[b-huj]

I just realized that there is a new Chinese Flanker coming from Witty, and from the picture released, it has a 3-digit bort number, which would suggest it is a J-11 instead of a Su-27. Well, Witty obviously uses the exact same mould so there is no difference. The J-11 is the Chinese-assembled version of the Su-27. Maybe Zed can give us a bit more information on this, all I found was this lousy little picture and an ETA for July 2008

[Tedongganas]

Nice grey paint scheme but why use the same mould ?? Don't they realised that the previous mould has some llaws ??

[Berkut76]

Originally Posted by b-huj

J-11 is the Chinese-assembled version of the Su-27

Not even close. J-11 is not a licensed copy of Su-27, but a knock off that causing a lot of rift between Russia and China at the moment. It should be smaller than a Flanker (a scale down version if you like), but is otherwise identical. Chinese failed to retro engineer advanced Russian engines and avionics, hence J-11 will go to the second line units and will be exported to third world countries.

I'm kind of surprised that Russians are surpised that Chinese did this to them.

Regards,

Sergey

[b-huj]

Originally Posted by Berkut76

Not even close. J-11 is not a licensed copy of Su-27, but a knock off that causing a lot of rift between Russia and China at the moment. It should be smaller than a Flanker (a scale down version if you like), but is otherwise identical. Chinese failed to retro engineer advanced Russian engines and avionics, hence J-11 will go to the second line units and will be exported to third world countries.

I'm kind of surprised that Russians are surpised that Chinese did this to them.

Regards,

Sergey

I know what you're talking about, but there is one detail you overlooked Sergei..."B"
The Chinese "bootleg" Su-27 is called J-11"B", while internally, they denominate all Su-27SK (exported from Russia) and Chinese assembled Su-27 (from set kits imported from Russia with SOME and increasingly MORE Chinese components) simply J-11, while their own unlincensed scaled down Su-27 is called J-11B. In any case, The size difference should be negligleable in 1/72 unless we're rivet counters, and Witty would never pass the test anyway. The Chinese don't plan on exporting J-11Bs AFAIK, they deem that and their "propietary" J-10 too valuable strategically and thus want to keep them inside their territory. they want to export the J-7 and in fact are doing so already (To Pakistan, amidst a strong US opposition, and Indian frustration). The Chinese claim the J-11B is superior to the Russian import, but we're talking about the basic SK, not the later advanced versions Su-30 and above exported to India and Malaysia...

I am also surprised Sukhoi didn't expect a copycat version to happen sooner or later, and if they are not, they are just playing along and demanding some sort of compensation for the intellectual property theft, so the Chinese were led into it, and both sides were very aware?!?!

In any case, the Witty Flanker needs a cockpit revamp, but I know they don't give a flying flanker about our comments.

[Rush104]

Originally Posted by Berkut76

I'm kind of surprised that Russians are surpised that Chinese did this to them.

Yeah, the Russians should have expected something like this. After all, the Russians did it to us by reverse engineering, then mass producing the B-29. What goes around, comes around.

[b-huj]

well, let's not go into this superiority/originality game...the Germans first used the jet engine and was captured/reverse engineered/copied/improved by American as well as Russian troops right after WWII.
there are too many examples of this in history, let's not even remember the space race and Mr. Gagarin...or the Sputnik...and no, I am not Russian.

[Andrew]

As the saying goes, why re-invent the wheel?

[b-huj]

Originally Posted by Andrew

As the saying goes, why re-invent the wheel?

emulation is one of the highest forms of praise

No matter how, I am still happy Witty is pulling out another Chinese Flanker, and a three-digit one. The mule has it on its list already, but the same crappy micro picture is shown.

[le differance]

. they want to export the J-7 and in fact are doing so already (To Pakistan, amidst a strong US opposition, and Indian frustration)

The J-7 is a MiG-21 clone...perhaps you meant to refer to the Chengdu FC-1, known in Pakistan as the JF-17. The FC-1 is officially described as a
collaborative effort between China and Pakistan. I have no clue how important or unimportant the Pakistani contributions to the program have actually
been, but it does seem incorrect to describe the Pakistanis as merely export customers, without mentioning the official claims or providing evidence
to refute them.

[b-huj]

Originally Posted by le differance

The J-7 is a MiG-21 clone...perhaps you meant to refer to the Chengdu FC-1, known in Pakistan as the JF-17.

you are absolutely right, I was referring to the FC-1/ JF-17, don't know why I typed J-7