[Ara1]

An utter waste.

[SKUNKY]

The co-pilot on that flight was Holland's squadron commander, Lt.Col Mark McGeehan who (as I understand it) absolutely detested Holland (the feeling was apparenty mutual) and wanted to have him grounded...McGeehan took the right seat that day because knowing Holland's reputation, he could not in good conscience have someone else fly in that position. Unfortunately it cost McGeehan his life...Holland would call guys who refused to fly with him "pussies". He was nothing but an ego-centric cowboy who obviously had no business flying an ultra-light, let alone anything belonging to the U.S. Air Force.

[ZS-VAN]

Some awesome footage but as has been said, people lost their lives in some of these incidents. That's very hectic.

[ZS-VAN]

Just watching the B52 footage, this guy was probably a big hit with spectators. Here all airshow sequences are practiced and approved before the show. Surely, the airshow organizers and the USAF would have seen the display and could have amended the sequences. As you say, it was bound to catch up with the pilot. Overconfidence can be a killer.

[SKUNKY]

Originally Posted by ZS-VAN

...this guy was probably a big hit with spectators..

Fortunately he never literally was..During a previous Fairchild airshow he flew directly over the crowd, which is a direct violation of Federal Aviation Regulations.....Imagine Ramstein multiplied by about ten...

[iamsam2407]

It makes me want to throw up every time I see that F4U crash because it was based here at Addison and I think Howard Pardue's F4F had a problem on the runway and the pilot of the F4U barely got off the ground and the prop caught the tail of the Wildcat and that what turned it on its side and then cart wheeled. I think that's what happened. The pilot did survive *Thank God* , but its hard to watch those videos of all those planes crashing.

[SKUNKY]

As a member of the hipocritical group who says "We really need to be preserving these birds,but man how I love to see and hear them babies fly" I just want to say, as tragic as it is whenever we lose warbirds like these, the fact is the longer we keep flying them, the more we're going to break them...

These airframes are pushing 70 years old now. Even with the best of maintenance, the weakest link is going to fail at the most inopportune time, and often with tragic results..It isn't quite the same as restoring a 1940 Willy's coup..When something inevitably craps out on the old jalopy, you can generally just pull it over to the side of the road and call AAA.

So the question is, how much longer can we keep flying them?..Until the last flyable example Mustang, Corsair, Spit, Zero augers in? That would be tragic, wouldn't it?,,,but nearly equally as tragic is the thought of us (and future generations) never again experiencing the indescribable spectacle of observing these thundering machines in their natural element..

In the end, the decision of course will be up to the individual aircraft owners...But one day the end will come for each and every one of them..Whether it be as a treasured museum piece, or a smoldering pile of wreckage. Happy thought, huh?.....

[jim]

Originally Posted by SKUNKY

As a member of the hipocritical group who says "We really need to be preserving these birds,but man how I love to see and hear them babies fly" I just want to say, as tragic as it is whenever we lose warbirds like these, the fact is the longer we keep flying them, the more we're going to break them...

These airframes are pushing 70 years old now. Even with the best of maintenance, the weakest link is going to fail at the most inopportune time, and often with tragic results..It isn't quite the same as restoring a 1940 Willy's coup..When something inevitably craps out on the old jalopy, you can generally just pull it over to the side of the road and call AAA.

So the question is, how much longer can we keep flying them?..Until the last flyable example Mustang, Corsair, Spit, Zero augers in? That would be tragic, wouldn't it?,,,but nearly equally as tragic is the thought of us (and future generations) never again experiencing the indescribable spectacle of observing these thundering machines in their natural element..

In the end, the decision of course will be up to the individual aircraft owners...But one day the end will come for each and every one of them..Whether it be as a treasured museum piece, or a smoldering pile of wreckage. Happy thought, huh?.....

Skunky in a serious and thoughtfull mood eh..As always Skunky you talk a lot of sense. A point I would like to make , well two points really, firstly I will use as an example the Spifire V BM597 at Duxford. This bird was a gate guardian for many years. It was completely rebuilt with ever part checked and double checked and replaced if needed, (its now better than when it was originally built). Because of the number of Spitfires flying today almost every part can be replaced with new including the main spar. The team that keep this bird in the air are one of the most experienced in the world and this rebuild has to be seen to be believed. The workmanship is of the highest standard possible.
The pilots that fly her are also the best. One of these pilots, Charlie Brown I have spoken of before, treats this Spitfire with the utmost respect, He once told me, I take care of her and she looks after me" The displays he puts on in this aeroplane look very high energy but are in fact designed to make sure that whilst the general public can see the Spit put through its paces the airframe is never subjected to any excess stress. All the displays and flown in such a way as to preserve the airframe.

The second point I would like to raise is the one about new builds. I would like to see more of these as shown by the FW190 and ME262 builds.
I feel sure that with common sense and well trained pilots that we will be able to see these beautifull birds in the air for many generations to come.


IMHO, one of the biggest problems faced is that of the pilots having enough hours on type. I have seen too many accidents where the pilot has made a fatal error due to lack of experience or flying time.
It is a difficult problem ,trying to conserve the flying hours of the airframe but at the same time keep the pilots up to speed.

Anyway thats my thoughts on this subject and to finish I will say that I hope that future generations of people can have the thrill of seeing these old girls flying.

[STARMAN 352ND]

July 29, 1999 - Wittman Regional Airport, Oshkosh, Wisconsin (USA) – A Corsair at full power on takeoff roll struck a Grumman Bearcat standing on the runway and burst into flames. A second Corsair, on takeoff roll in formation with the first one, sustained substantial damage when the pilot saw a second Grumman Bearcat positioned on the runway in front of his plane, and elected to steer his airplane off of the runway to avoid the other airplane.
The pilot of the first Corsair was seriously injured. The pilot of the Grumman Bearcat reported no injuries. The pilot of the second Corsair received minor injuries.
JP

[hworth18]

Originally Posted by SKUNKY

As a member of the hipocritical group who says "We really need to be preserving these birds,but man how I love to see and hear them babies fly" I just want to say, as tragic as it is whenever we lose warbirds like these, the fact is the longer we keep flying them, the more we're going to break them...

These airframes are pushing 70 years old now. Even with the best of maintenance, the weakest link is going to fail at the most inopportune time, and often with tragic results..It isn't quite the same as restoring a 1940 Willy's coup..When something inevitably craps out on the old jalopy, you can generally just pull it over to the side of the road and call AAA.

So the question is, how much longer can we keep flying them?..Until the last flyable example Mustang, Corsair, Spit, Zero augers in? That would be tragic, wouldn't it?,,,but nearly equally as tragic is the thought of us (and future generations) never again experiencing the indescribable spectacle of observing these thundering machines in their natural element..

In the end, the decision of course will be up to the individual aircraft owners...But one day the end will come for each and every one of them..Whether it be as a treasured museum piece, or a smoldering pile of wreckage. Happy thought, huh?.....

I agree with you Skunky..
I am also a member of this group and I think the "fly/no fly" debate will be one to be fought over for years to come.. I do feel thought that with the ever shrinking number of flyable warbirds and the increasing video technology available today, planes in flight can be recorded and shown in theatre type conditions to future generations.. Yes, I know it isn't the same as seeing a real flight, but I would much rather see one roarig across the big screen than just hearing about it from the "old timers" because there aren't any left in existance..
Jims comment is also valid for the "new" build warbirds to replace the old ones that are becoming increasingly rarer with every passing year.. New airframes could be made of flying/museum examples now in existance and those
new "replica" planes could be flown in place of the real thing..