[jim]

Originally Posted by MoMo

you must get into the same state as me Timbo, and see too many documentaries!!!!


BUT....England got beat 2 - 1 by Germany ! ( he, he, he...... ) only kidding !

You were surprised ???

[MoMo]

JIM

You were surprised ???

No, Jim, I couldn't hear the strains of " The Great Escape" all night!

[Spanner 28]

Originally Posted by MoMo

I quote short-fuse from the " British Army Rumour " site.

He is listing the 10 worst tanks ever! I don't know if I agree with him, but he seems to have picked a few pups!

How about it, Guys, do you agree?

1. Cheiftain AVRE particularly the Willich variant ( there is no need to explain).
2. Crusader (a 60 tonne nightmare)
3. Sherman (Zippo lighter that it was).
4. Wippet
5. T-62 (very crap replacement for T-55 that didn't work).
6. A-7 (German WW1 Tank).
7. Valentine (moved at 4 MPH and had a pop gun).
8. Jagd Tiger (not technically a tank buy 80 tonne mechanical nightmare).
9. KV-1 (Russian early war behemoth that the Germans totalled in seconds).
10. Maus (100 tonne mechanical nightmare again from our Aryan cousins 1945 vintage)

Item 2 - Crusader - Since when was the crusader a 60 ton tank? Shows the credibility of the list. By the time they fixed the reliability problems caused by poor air filters and poor quality track they proved very successful (Tunisia and Post Alamein). The Brits were ill prepared for War as opposed to the Germans who had been building their forces (and trialling and fine tuning equip and tactics in Spain during the Civil War) since the mid thirties. The biggest problem faced by the Crusader in the Desert was the 2 pdr gun. At this stage of the war it was more than adequate for anti tank work and contrary to earlier statements was very successful up till the Pz IV G. Unfortunately through flawed thinking it did not have an HE round therefore could not defend itself adequately against AT guns. The German tactic of drawing Brit tanks into AT screens led to the vast majority of Brit Tank lossesin the desert. It wa s not until an Australian Ornance officer adapted the French HE warhead from the French 75 to the US M2/3 75mm gun in the Sherman and M3 Medium that the 8th army could adequately fight.
Whilst looking over an 88 Flak 18 at RAAC Museum with a friend, a vet who was with Sherwood Yeomanry indicated that they feared the 88 until they got the US mediums with HE. He said they didn't fear them after that and could adequately fight back. He said his Grant used to use the 37 as the AT weapon at under 800m and they carried mainly HE and Smoke for the hull 75. It was quite an enlightening conversation.

Item 3 - Sherman - see my first post

Item 7 - Valentine - was loved by its crews in the Desert and tunisia but suffered due to lack of HE as did the Crusader - Flawed doctrine had infantry support tanks fighting other tanks - pretty flawed to not have a dual purpose gun in an infantry support weapon.

Item 9 - KV1 - what crap, this was a highly successful design which the germans feared and respected. The KV 2 was a mistake but still terrified the German with one example holding up an advance alone for over 36 hrs until finally being dispatched by an 88 at close range. The Russians were very happy with this design which evolved into the highly feared and successful JS 1 & 2 series.

Cheers

[MoMo]

thanks Spanner 28.

I wonder if the other guys agree?