[DADoser]

(I’m NOT trying to start a heated debate here or get too political/contraversial. I’m just trying to share a couple personal incidents in order to give perspective on the very hot topic of Race/Racism in America. This is just personal experience in order to try to add a perspective to the issue. Nothing is a personal attack – however there may be a couple beliefs/perspectives challenged.)


After the very and currently heated Immus incident –

My wife (who is African-American; graduated with a Marketing degree from U of IL – Chicago; and has worked in corporate America for the past 17 years – State Farm Ins. and currently Edward Jones – hardly a “fringe” AA and one who clearly is part of the corporate establishment and obviously has nothing against white folks, as she has been married to me for more than 18 years. ), made the following statement:

“This makes me think that no matter what, I will always be a nigg*r.”

My reply to her was “Really?? - even though he didn’t use the word nigg*r.”

In made me realize that after 18 years of inter-racial marriage; having 2 bi-racial children; interacting with Black folks – in-laws; members of the historically Black fraternity that I’m a member of; co-workers/colleagues; friends; and the numerous Black students I’ve worked with in my career, I will NEVER truly understand what it means or feels like to be an African-American. I can look at things objectively – but will never be in touch or truly understand the feelings that come with that history/experience/identity.

Telling her to "get over" a part of her identity/ethnic history is just not fair to her as an individual. It disrespects her and robs her of her history/experience/feelings. Even though she is not nor has ever been on the Rutgers women's basketball team - because of America's racially charged past, statements' like Immus' have huge emotional impact. (Even though I would defend his right to say anything he wants - his freedom of speech.)

If Blacks prefer to refer to themselves as African-American, I’m ok with that. If it helps them put their history/experience into perspective – who cares? It doesn’t take anything away from or threaten me, my “whiteness,” or the United States of America. Honestly, adding an identity - (blank) -American - simply is an effert to bring a unique experience to the idea of being AMERICAN - nowhere is there an effort by groups to delete or dismiss "American" from the identity they claim. Folk who feel (rightly or wrongly) that they are on the margins of American society desperately want to feel judged/treated on the content of their character - not the "name" they prefer to be called.

Again, whether you agree or not with the methods and terminology of ethnic movements in America – the MAJORITY trends and goals of all these groups have been to be INCLUDED in the larger American Dream – not carve out anything separate or break the U.S. apart. That is historical fact. (I’ll have to double-check here – but I’m pretty sure that after Lincoln freed the slaves, he was in favor of sending them back to Africa.)


Here’s another personal incident that happened to us recently (and this is the one and only time it has happened in 18+ years).

A couple months ago, my 11yr old son found a flyer on our driveway. The flyer has an artist drawing of a blonde white woman and at the top it said “Love Your Race.” At the bottom was a website. It was from a white supremist/neo-nazi(??) organization. That is clearly against race mixing and bi-racial children.

I’m not exactly sure – but I think the flyers were distributed throughout the neighborhood in a local campaign by this organization. So were we targeted individually? - probably not – but for me/us it was still pretty personal.

I am a lot more concerned about the “Balkinization” and threat of ethnic violence from organizations like this one (which quite honestly more accurately reflects U.S. racial history) than some Latino group protesting a Ken Burns PBS documentary.

http://forum.themodelhangar.com/showthread.php?t=3428


Again, I’m not tying to attack ANYONE here. I'm also confident that those who are disgusted with the Latino protest are equally disgusted with the flyer placed on my driveway. I just wanted to throw some personal experience/perspective in order for folks to see another perspective regarding race in America.

[Shawn 507]

Going out on a limb here.
I wonder if people would be as pissed if a black radio personality had made the comments? I hesitate to use Afro-American when we never really know a persons true ethnic nationality. When the Hip Hop culture / terms / lifestyle etc.. begins to become mainstream, why would anyone get upset when its used by non-black person? Cultural integration only goes one way?
I'm not saying he was right to say what he did. I personally think the only improper word used was Ho. And yes appearances count. So tats and other unusual things one does to their appearance does effect how one is judged. And thats what the comment was about.
Its all good in college, but in the really real world people do judge. I've yet to see personal appearance fall into the EO realm, but I'm sure its only a matter of time.
Unfortunately, this team will be forever known by the comment made. Had they turned the other cheek, maybe they would have been remembered for their accomplishments.
Is it right? I cannot say. For the record, my step-mother is an Afro-American and more of a mother to me than my own flesh and blood one. Its a sad event, but I doubt anything truely good has come of it.
- Shawn

[djjeffhall]

DADoser,
You are correct, none of us who are not African American will ever truly know what it is like being black in America. It is also true that the African American experience in America is unique among racial groups in America. (Which isn't to say that each group doesn't have its own issues related to their heritage, just that the AA experience is unique.)

Slavery and "Back-of-the-bus" looms large with African Americans today in the same way that Nazi Germany looms large with many Jews. While slavery might have "ended" 150 years ago, its step-child didn't end until integration, which was within the lifetimes of many folks here on this forum, and many of the people raising the issue in regards it Imus. (That doesn't even get into the inherent racism that persists and rears its ugly head all to often in everyday life.)

I don't really want to further the whole "What if someone other than Imus said that?" or the, "Why can Quentin Tarantino get away with it and Imus can't?" arguments as it gets off the point. (Imus, being a major radio and TV host should know better.)

I''m sorry DADoser that you have to deal with that neo-nazi idiocy on a day to day basis. I grew up south of the mason-dixon and had to deal with family members who supported the KKK and thought folks like David Duke and Lyndon Larouche were "progressive". Unfortunately it is not something that I think anyone here will get away from in our lifetimes, but hopefully we will get a little closer.

[mikeb1958]

Is it just ME..or is this thread just a continuation of that other thread from last week??? Sure sounds like it to me! Did anyone see Dateline last night? They interviewed those Duke Lacrosse guys. Whose lives were more destoyed...the Duke University boys OR the Rutger Woman's basketball team??? Not a rocket scientist there....

[PH-LKK]

The most amazing discovery (for me at least) I have made in adulthood is the different perspective on "race" offered by "black" Africans who immigrate to the United States. Those I have had the pleasure of knowing are consistently surprised and disappointed by what they see as an "obsession with race" by black Americans. Black Americans who journey to Europe or Africa are similarly amazed to learn that they are significantly more "American" (share more with their "white" American comrades) than "African". It is one of the great paradoxes of U.S. culture that so much "racial tension" is utterly mysterious to non-Americans who otherwise might appear racially identical to "persecuted minorities" in this country. A close friend of mine who immigrated here during University has gone so far as tell me that she avoids forming friendships with black Americans because "they're so screwed up" ("All they want to talk about is 'being Black'").

I have long appreciated the ways in which skin color has been improperly used as a measure of the worth of a human being. What I did not appreciate until I had formed friendships with many native born Africans is the degree to which many black Americans appear to have adopted the most pernicious aspects of "race" as a means of self-identification. This is not merely the residue of slavery (which, as a distinctly "racial" institution, persisted for less than 400 of the past 500 years). Something else must account for the degree to which "race" has become such a dominant element of self consciousness for black Americans, even as "race neutrality" has grown in acceptance as the hallmark of polite culture.

[Canucklehead]

HEY!

BEFORE ANYONE ELSE POSTS TO THIS THREAD!

Go back and read DADoser's post. READ it. It's about him and his life. It is about one of our forum member's actual personal experiences, and gives a perspective many of us may not usually see.

Treat this thread and it's author with the respect that it is deserving of.

This thread IS NOT a continuation of the thread that was closed from last week! Any efforts to continue in that vein will be deleted.

[Folgore]

Hey, did y'all see Ara1's joke about Corgi coming out with a B-36? Whew, that was funny...

[Ara1]

Originally Posted by Folgore

Hey, did y'all see Ara1's joke about Corgi coming out with a B-36? Whew, that was funny...

Thank you...


Hey everyone, Folgore is commenting on my "anger interruption" posting where I lie and say Corgi's releasing Jimmy Stewart's B-36, "The Margaret Moran" in 1/72. And then in the same thread I talked about how on Michael Jackson's video "Beat It", two gangs learn it's much better to dance than fight.

DADoser: right on for marrying someone you love. For living the dream of making a family. Keep supporting each other and teaching kindness as a value. I'd take that over the alternative any day.

To my fellow diecasters: If everyone thought about being kind first, before we left our doors in the morning, then maybe one day we wouldn't have to lock those doors. Maybe there'd be no road rage or computer flaming or hurtful words over the airwaves. Think about the one person in your life who you respect the most, and chances are, they were kind to you. Share it. And learn how cool your neighbors are.

[SKUNKY]

You lock your doors, Ara?. ..oh, that's right...Massachusetts!. .....(that's why I don't live there anymore)..

I still can't believe you lied to us about Jimmy Stewart's B-36...What kind of sick mind would do such a thing?... ..I went and had a huge shelf specially made in anticipation of it's arrival....

[PH-LKK]

Originally Posted by Canucklehead

HEY!

BEFORE ANYONE ELSE POSTS TO THIS THREAD!

Go back and read DADoser's post. READ it. It's about him and his life. It is about one of our forum member's actual personal experiences, and gives a perspective many of us may not usually see.

Treat this thread and it's author with the respect that it is deserving of.

This thread IS NOT a continuation of the thread that was closed from last week! Any efforts to continue in that vein will be deleted.

Did I say something offensive? I certainly hope not. None intended.