[Waltz41]

So you might of all seen it on tv, 2 super hornets and 2 hornets, along with the 4 Apache's......but I saw it from a different view....that of at NAS Willow Grove, which is where the planes staged out of. Had some info with some other photographers and aviation enthusiasts about take offs and arrivals, so although I missed the arrivals on friday (including VFA-2 Bounty Hunters CAG Bird) due to a different runway being used, I was there to catch 2 coming in this morning, and then the take offs and the return. Here's the best part though......A few guys I was with had scanners and were listening in to when they were going to take off and arrive. Anyways....long story short, the tower wouldn't let them leave because they didn't file a flight plan!!! Seriously, the freaking Army-Navy flyover and they were serioulsy so close to them not taking off and scrubbing the mission.
I'm not a pilot, but apparently it was because they wanted to go VFR but the tower didn't have any thing for that, so they were trying to get them to file the flight plan. (Any pilots confirm this? Mustangdriver? A guy there said you don't need to file a flight plane for any VFR flight)
Anyways....The conversation had the tower giving the phone number for williamsport and woodstown to get flight clearance I guess, but phone numbers??? The pilot told the tower it's kind of hard to hear when the jet is running. He apparently did make a call or something happened, because he asked for the number again, unless he was being a smart @$$! I was surprised though, because the lead kept his cool through it all. At one point, they actually were going to shut down the plane, and then he just shut down 1 engine so that paper work could be run out to the plane. There was a female pilot, who was the lead of the 2nd flight, and you could hear her saying "If we don't leave in 2 to 3 minutes we are not making this flyover." The tower replied...."You are not leaving until we have a flight plan" Finally, they got rolling and high tailed it out there. Took off at about 205 i guess it was, did the flyover at 231 and were back at 241 to Willow Grove.
IT was really cool, interesting, and funny to listen to the whole thing. Everyone couldn't beleive though what was happening, this was the flyover that everyone was waiting for, almost scrubbed because of some moron in the tower!!! Here's some pics!

[Waltz41]

[SKUNKY]

Great shots and an excellent story to go along with 'em.....Thanks!

[skysurfer808]

Hey Waltz;

Great story and pics. From what I know about flying as a Flight Instructor, you don't need a flight plan to Fly VFR, all you need to do is to radio Ground Control with your taxi destination, and Tower with your departure clearance. Airports have different departure procedures, these are usually given various names for ease of use. A departure clearance lets Air Traffic Control know where you are going. What probably happened is that the Tower Assumed a formation of Military Fighter jets were going to fly above 18,000 feet, at which altitude all aircraft must fly under Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) and file a flight plan. From what you've described, this 10 minute fly by never went above that. So the Flight Lead was likely just trying to keep the flight VFR for convenience and timesaving sake. It just doesn't make sense to file a flight plan for a 10 minute sortie. VFR Flight gives the pilot in command authority to fly on his own once leaving controlled airspace, within legally defined parameters of course (no flying under 1000 feet over populated areas..etc.)

The controller probably freaked out at the assemblage of military aircraft, and was worried about its conflicting with the traffic flow at his airport. He was just doing his job, while the Flight Lead was trying to do his. In favor of the display pilots is the fact that standard ATC procedures call for formations to be treated as a single Aircraft, and as Military Aviators usually fly in formation, they are are quite competent to keep together and out of the way of conflicting air traffic. Somebody who knew probably sorted the whole thing out so the show could go on.

In Honolulu, ATC handles Hawaii Air National Guard F-15 departures in its own unique way. The F-15s have their own standard Departure, so when you hear "Mai Tai, Hang 10" you get a treat. The F-15s light their burners, blaze down the runway, then climb Vertically till they clear Controlled Airspace, at which point they go and do their thing without inferference from ATC. ATC loves this because it gets the F-15s quickly out of their airspace, letting them concentrate on directing Civilian Traffic. Honolulu is also unique for sharing runways with Hickam AFB, so you get to see some interesting sights there.

Hope that gives some insight to you.

Aloha,

Skysurfer808

[chiefs70]

Very nicely done. Thank you for the pics.

The flight plan episode shows how beauracracy dominates the world we live in even when it approaches farce. I remember my brother telling me how when he boarded the charter flight to Kuwait for OIF in 2003 he went through metal detectors and had to be scanned for weapons.... with this M16 slung on his shoulder and one magazine of ammo issued in case they needed to leave the aircraft combat ready.

Thanks again for the pics.

[bsmith13]

I just typed a great big long response, and had to delete it after I read that the Hornets were launching from NAS Willow Grove.

Here's the deal. As far as I know, military aircraft must always file a flight plan. They can cancel the flight plan and go VFR once they are airborne, but they have to have a flight plan. Just before the flight, the pilots go to base ops and file a flight plan.

I think this is probably a screw up of the pilots, as they thought that they wouldn't need a flight plan for such a short flight. In the mean time, the SOF (supervisor of flying - a military pilot who sits in the tower to be a liason to the flying squadrons) is jumping through hoopes, calling down to base ops to try and get them to file a flight plan for the jets burning fuel on the ramp. The flight plan finally gets filed by OS2 Snuffy, and the jets can depart.

In this particular instance, don't sling too much mud at the controller for doing their jobs, sling it at the pilots who don't pay much attention to ATC rules.

[admin]

I love the flyover pics. I think that the army kinda gets upstaged in this format though. I would recommend running a column of Abrams through midfield .

[Captain Eddie]

Originally Posted by admin

I love the flyover pics. I think that the army kinda gets upstaged in this format though. I would recommend running a column of Abrams through midfield .

That would be worth watching....seeing the Navy defence trying to stop a tank!

[STARMAN 352ND]

Originally Posted by Captain Eddie

That would be worth watching....seeing the Navy defence trying to stop a tank!

Them F-18's would whip them to bits.
But i agree with Gavin the Army always seems to get upstaged in this.
JP

[Waltz41]

Well....the Army also has gotten upstaged in the game, the last five years, well....Navy has won!

I went back today for their departures. Apparently two of the superbugs left last nite at 930. they were really ticked at everything and wanted to get home as soon as possible. at about 330 there were 3 Charlie models left, and they gave us a really nice low, afterburner departure. Was beautiful!!!

Thanks everyone for the comments on what had happened too. The guys I was with really all agreed that it was Willow Grove Tower that was screwing things up, not the pilots.........I don't know the whole story, I really couldn't follow everything on the scanner. they were talking about it today a little bit, I think what i gathered was that they had an IFR flight plan filed, but then once in the jets changed to fly VFR. I don't really know, but all the other guys there, including a former c-130 pilot agreed it was the tower....so i guess i missed something there. anyways.....it was a very interesting story. here's the a shot I got of one of the C's and a superhornet leaving. also there was a c-130 taking off as well. Took a little movie with the others, maybe i'll see if i can get it up.