[flyXwire]

Originally Posted by Rush104

I hear ya! It's been close to twenty years since I've been there. I'm betting not much has changed.
Hopefully the USMC already has the statement prepared for when Berkeley starts screaming for federal help after the next earthquake levels that place...

Believe me when I say that the USMC is very accomodating even for those ingratefull blowhards from Berzerkley.

[KG_Jag]

It's great to see SF's friend, just across the shore to the east, again expressing its great commitment to freedom, tolerance and free speech--provided they fall far left of center. I'm sure that most of the citizens there would easily and quickly adapt to mandatory burkas and Islam.

[FormerViperDriver]

Originally Posted by Old Crow

If I'm reading this right, it isn't the university (this time). It is the actual town of Berkeley that's doing this.

The City Council, to be specific. But, if you know anything about Berkeley, there is not much difference.

Well, UC Berkeley does have ROTC (all services) on campus...

FVD

[Folgore]

It stands to reason that not everyone in Berkeley is anti-USMC. If that were the case, why would the Marines bother manning a recruiting office there in the first place?

On another note: the city council is now considering either retracting or modifying the original "unwelcome mat" measure. Although, of course, that's a bit like closing the barn door after the horses have escaped. It was an incredibly silly and tone-deaf thing to do in the first place.

[11SQNLDR]

The council come accross as a half-witted bunch of un-patriotic limp noodles. But that's just my view from this side of the Pacific...

[planenutsfrog]

Originally Posted by KG_Jag

It's great to see SF's friend, just across the shore to the east, again expressing its great commitment to freedom, tolerance and free speech--provided they fall far left of center. I'm sure that most of the citizens there would easily and quickly adapt to mandatory burkas and Islam.

If they don't feel at home in the USA, why don't they come in our good ol' Islamo - Democratic Republic of France...?!

The "Sorbonne" in Paris (from where Pol Pot, among other altruist celebrities, graduated...), would welcome them !!!

And Mickael Moore could come too : All rotten eggs in the same stinking basket !

But would you be ready to welcome us, new poor "boat peoples" fleeing the shores of our native land...?

[Folgore]

The saga continues...

What's interesting -- and disturbing -- is how issues like this quickly become oversimplified into conservative vs. liberal battles, as in this copy: "The city's statement about the Marines immediately ignited an uproar from conservative, pro-military and pro-war factions around the country." Plenty of liberal and/or anti-war folks thought the Berkeley City Council's resolution was screwy, too. The only adjective in that list that might apply all or most of the time is "anti-military." This is sloppy reporting -- it conflates conservative with pro-military and pro-war, and liberal with the reverse. The terms "liberal" and "conservative" become shorthand for a whole set of beliefs, values, etc. that probably very few liberals or conservatives adhere to 100%. I certainly don't.

And then there's this silly person: "'I am absolutely incensed,' said Cheryl Tolman, a 12-year Berkeley resident. 'It's outrageous that the City Council is trying to close the Marines office down and let these total radicals protest there. This is supposed to be the city of free speech.'" Well, Cheryl, if Berkeley is a city of free speech you shouldn't shut down the Marines or the total radicals, right?



Read Orwell's "Politics and the English Language," people!

[Captain Eddie]

Originally Posted by Folgore

The saga continues...

What's interesting -- and disturbing -- is how issues like this quickly become oversimplified into conservative vs. liberal battles, as in this copy: "The city's statement about the Marines immediately ignited an uproar from conservative, pro-military and pro-war factions around the country." Plenty of liberal and/or anti-war folks thought the Berkeley City Council's resolution was screwy, too. The only adjective in that list that might apply all or most of the time is "anti-military." This is sloppy reporting -- it conflates conservative with pro-military and pro-war, and liberal with the reverse. The terms "liberal" and "conservative" become shorthand for a whole set of beliefs, values, etc. that probably very few liberals or conservatives adhere to 100%. I certainly don't.

You definitely make a good point, Folgore.......what you say may well, and most likely does, apply to regular rank and file democrats, but, when you look at the Democratic leadership in both the House and Senate, they are, for the most part (Lieberman would be one outstanding exception), in my opinion (backed up by their own statements) anti-military. They talk a good talk of "supporting the troops" but they mostly do everything in their power to do the exact opposite.

[Shawn 507]

Marines out, trans-gender conference in. What a town!! Someone please cut all federal aid and spending to this town.

[KG_Jag]

Perhaps the core issue here is that a city government determined (or attempted to determine) whose speech and legal actions (recruiting) to repress, and whose speech and political views was to receive special favorable treatment (Code Pink).

Very dangerous stuff--can you think of any similar acts from relatively recent history?!