[Aircrafty]

Originally Posted by Cardinal

Be honest Aircrafty, are you just trying to stir the debate pot or do you really subcribe to this view . In my view the logic is untenable ...

Hey Cardinal, all the 'logical' New Zealanders moved to Australia

It's FEAR that drives this issue

The same fear that caused the Cold War and gives an old lady a false sense of security because she has a .357 handgun (I doubt if the average drugged up robber would know what she had).

Fear was used to get the people of the US and the 'coalition' to occupy Iraq - because of weapons that did not exist.

The Crusades proved to be folly, surely we are long past being conned into marching to war in God's name.

[1250ships]

Originally Posted by skysurfer808

The Right Honorable Gentlemen ought to be aware of People Republic's latest acquisition, a genuine 1/1 Scale Aircraft Carrier, and some 1/1 scale Su-33 Sea Flankers to arm her.

http://www.sinodefence.com/navy/surf...aftcarrier.asp

http://www.sinodefence.com/news/2006/news06-10-24.asp

They certainly got a bargain on the Varyag, and the Sea Flankers will provide a potent anti-air capability for the People's Liberation Army Navy. (That's how they say it there.) So if the People's Republic is following a peaceful nation's path, how come they are acquiring an Aircraft Carrier?

I wouldn't get too worried about Varyag. She has no engines. She has no electronics. Sure those can be added but it will be major problem to get engines properly fitted to her. I have no doubt they can put engines in- just lots of doubts about the long term reliability of the installation.

She also is old technology in that she was first laid down in 1988. The earliest she will be ready for sea is 2010. At that point she will be effectively 20 years old. Soviet era ships have not had a great record of long life. Of course India is doing much the same thing with the Kiev class hull.

If Varyag ever meet the US Navy I think she would discover, as did many Japanese carriers, that the biggest danger would come from the Silent Service. And if the subs don't get her she would be facing 2 or 3 carrier battle groups with superior carriers with over 80 years of carrier experience.

[admin]

Originally Posted by Aircrafty

Hey Cardinal, all the 'logical' New Zealanders moved to Australia

It's FEAR that drives this issue

The same fear that caused the Cold War and gives an old lady a false sense of security because she has a .357 handgun (I doubt if the average drugged up robber would know what she had).

Fear was used to get the people of the US and the 'coalition' to occupy Iraq - because of weapons that did not exist.

The Crusades proved to be folly, surely we are long past being conned into marching to war in God's name.

I'm not going to comment on that one, even though I would really like to do so. Uhhh.....Mmmmm....... Yea, proceed with caution.

[Aircrafty]

Originally Posted by skysurfer808

..........So if the People's Republic is following a peaceful nation's path, how come they are acquiring an Aircraft Carrier?
Skysurfer808

No doubt there are billions of Chinese wondering why the US has about twelve

[Aircrafty]

Originally Posted by Berkut76

This is really sad and pathetic. It looks like the pacifist tendencies of the mainland Europe taken to the extreme spread to the once mighty Great Britain.

It's realy downright disturbing to acknowledge that the US will have to battle rising and confident forces of evil by itself yet again:

Regards,

Sergey

P.S. I can already picture the Hitler of Persia jumping up and down.

The admin guy said he was holding back from my recent post which reminded me of the original post on this thread

I'm sure I'm not the only non US forum member that found this initial post offensive. I don't want to upset things but let's be fair. The US was late to WWI and WWII and would not have been on the winning side in either world war without the assistance of its allies. Further more there are currently about 17 other countries among the coalition forces in Iraq (including Australia) as well as other trouble spots such as Afghanistan.

Frankly it really PMO when I see that yet again 'history' has been modified to raise the profile of the US whilst diminishing the involvement of other allied countries. Surely every democratic country has its own rite to make their own economic decisions without being dictated to.

Btw, the last time I saw the 'Hitler of Persia' mentioned was in a spam email I received last week requesting a donation to help God's people, whoever they may be. In any case I replied "God helps those that help themselves".

[Ted in DC]

While unhappy about the news regarding cutbacks in the Royal Navy, and think the topic worthy of much discussion (will the planned new carriers ever see the light of day?), I'd also like to see overtly political statements/discussion be kept off the Model Hangar or confined to some sort of off-topic thread or forum. Ironic for someone living in DC, but we're swimming in politics here and it's nice to get away from it at the Model Hangar.

[jim]

Just thought I would throw this one in the pot. When most of Europe is dependent on Russia for all its power supplies including Britain what do we do if Russia shouts jump? Yes we shall all have to jump or shut down Europe. Food for thought eh?

[jim]

Hello Ted, in answer to your question will the planned new carriers see the light of day. NO. Well you live in DC would you believe a politician?

Originally Posted by Ted in DC

While unhappy about the news regarding cutbacks in the Royal Navy, and think the topic worthy of much discussion (will the planned new carriers ever see the light of day?), I'd also like to see overtly political statements/discussion be kept off the Model Hangar or confined to some sort of off-topic thread or forum. Ironic for someone living in DC, but we're swimming in politics here and it's nice to get away from it at the Model Hangar.

[Ted in DC]

Yeah, I'm not too optimistic at this point! What ships will be left to escort them after all the cutbacks? On the bright side, Italy's new Cavour looks pretty cool.

[SKUNKY]

Don't worry, everyone. I heard that Carnival Cruise Lines is planning on nearly doubling its fleet within the next 20 years...We'll be okay.