[PappyB]

I've seen several auctions for FM models on ebay with UPCs and certs removed, they are the same models that many online vendors are currently selling at big discounts. Members have also reported getting sale models with the certs and UPCs missing, others have received the same models, on sale, with both intact.

My guess is all of these models are those FM has authorized price dumps on, people who get them with the certs/upcs are getting models that were in stock before the dump, and the rest coming from FM have the certs and UPCs removed. Now why would FM do that? And what do you think about vendors selling them this way, on sale, without noting the removal of the certs/UPCs?? (this kinda thing happens overseas with Corgi all the time, right?)

I don't like it personally. I know it's not a big deal and it's the models that are important (plus FM certs are a joke anyways --but it's more the point/principal I'm after here). As long as the models are in tip-top shape who cares, right? Well, hardcore FM collectors might care... seems fishy to me, and I'm not in this group. ??

Seems at teh very least online vendors should play by the same rules of disclosure as ebay sellers....

[flyXwire]

The FM models on sale I bought from the link posted at "Good Deals" had the certs and UPCs both intact on mine when I received it lastweek. Go figure!

[PappyB]

Originally Posted by flyXwire

The FM models on sale I bought from the link posted at "Good Deals" had the certs and UPCs both intact on mine when I received it lastweek. Go figure!

In this thread, which I think is the one you are referring to, you say models from BC and WW DID NOT have the UPCs or certs Wings & Wheels also has Armour sale

[flyXwire]

Originally Posted by PappyB

In this thread, which I think is the one you are referring to, you say models from BC and WW DID NOT have the UPCs or certs Wings & Wheels also has Armour sale

Originally Posted by PappyB

Yes, that is the thread but if you notice on post #7 I mentioned Monkey Depot and Wings and Wheel had none of the UPCs and Certs. The items I received from the other online store had them. If you're confused now...so am I!

[aeroeng]

I was talking to The Flying Mule a couple days ago and they said it was just a FM sanctioned sale. They didn't mention anything about dumping planes or missing certs. I know they were selling out their existing stocks because several are now on back order. So I'm guessing they'll have their certs & UPC's. We'll know sometime soon (I hope ). I ordered the Mig-17 below but it's back ordered.

"image used with permission from The Flying Mule"

[PappyB]

Originally Posted by flyXwire

Yes, that is the thread but if you notice on post #7 I mentioned Monkey Depot and Wings and Wheel had none of the UPCs and Certs. The items I received from the other online store had them. If you're confused now...so am I!

I'm always confused it seems -- nice to have some company

FYI -- I asked WW about this today, they said "What's a cert, and what's a UPC?" Oiye!

But they say they pass along the models exactly as they come from FM, so if you got some from WW without the UPC and certs, FM is distributing them to WW in that condition.

And aero -- you will probably get models with everything as another member got his from the Mule intact (again, I think that if vendors have the sanctioned sale items in stock, you get 'em complete, it seems FM may be shipping the sale items out now with the certs and UPCs pulled for some reason....)

I would be shocked if Martin would sell models that have been altered in any way without being really clear and up front about it.

[Biggie]

I dont know if this is the same thing, but I got two FM 1/48 scale WWII Birds, One Corsair and one Wildcat, on Ebay for $28.00 each, both were missing the cert and entire side panel. But I knew it from the auction before I got them and for half the price I can live with it, since I mainly wanted the plane and not looking to make money on increasing value, I think thats a think of the past with these except on the occasional really rare model. the guy has more of them two most are under $30.00. A great deal on this size plane.

Biggie

[stalag8611]

In September I ordered three Gemini aircraft from TFM. Either Martin or Bill called and told me that "Berlin Express" was available, their last one in stock, but without a cert. I could wait for a certified " Berlin Express" or take the one in stock. The P-51B 363FS/357FG looks great on the fireplace mantle. So, what's with the cert issue? I'm 74, the over 200 issues of various scales are worth about what I originally paid, maybe even less, with perhaps 2 or 3 having risen in value. My point: no collector's hit-the-gong profit for me: however. my grandchildren, 50 years from now, may really profit. Hence, the best and only reason for the adding a meaningless piece of paper to a box.

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

[PappyB]

Originally Posted by Biggie

I dont know if this is the same thing, but I got two FM 1/48 scale WWII Birds, One Corsair and one Wildcat, on Ebay for $28.00 each, both were missing the cert and entire side panel. But I knew it from the auction before I got them and for half the price I can live with it, since I mainly wanted the plane and not looking to make money on increasing value, I think thats a think of the past with these except on the occasional really rare model. the guy has more of them two most are under $30.00. A great deal on this size plane.

Biggie

That is what I'm talking about, sounds like you got a couple of the altered models that are being dumped. I agree, great prices, and as I said, it's the model the really matters. But I don't want this to be a "I collect for thelove of the planes not the packaging" thread please

I do have an issue with product being sold as "new" with no mention of it being altered. Okay, it's the packaging, and okay this is FM and prices are not likely to be affected. Like I said in my original post, it's the principle I'm talking about... product is being sold with no mention of these changes, or why they are being made, and we as buyers don't know until we get the boxes on our doorstep. That's what I don't think is right.

But I'm probably making mountains of mole hills again from the sounds of things. But I am curious why Franklin Mint would remove the UPC labels from stock it wants put on sale, or the certs for that matter, does it not stand behind the sale models as top-notch FM product? Are they factory seconds? Who knows?

[hworth18]

I noticed today that OMI can also be added to the Franklin sale list...